So, things have been thrilling in this book lately haven’t they? I don’t know how I get to sleep sometimes with all the amazing and shocking things occurring around Venus Cove. Don’t worry, this chapter isn’t going to let you down.
This chapter, like the last one, is largely pointless and pretty much could have been taken out without hurting the plot. If anything, the plot would have moved a little bit past the rate of a glacier. Now, don’t get me wrong. I’m all for character development, scenes when people are talking and even scenes that don’t really have a lot to do with the plot that exist for character development or world development. Some of my favorite scenes from books and movies are silly little scenes that don’t really advance the story, but either bring me closer to the characters or give me a better idea of what kind of place the setting is.
The problem with Adornetto is that she doesn’t really do this. She has conversation, but honestly, Bethany, Naybriel and Ivy are as two dimensional as they were when I first met them. If anything the conversations make them more two dimensional.
So, right after the important doings of the dinner table, in which we found that Bethany is a lying angel, Ivy has managed to get possession of a Death Note, and Naybriel doesn’t understand that some ingredients don’t go together, they decide to clean up. Bethany is nervous about this free time because, as everyone knows
time in the kingdom didn’t exist.
Now, I might be being nitpicky here, but I really don’t like this statement. It doesn’t make sense. If time doesn’t exist, then it would be impossible to perform any action since the action couldn’t ever be finished as it would be in the same moment of time as it began. I know what she’s trying to say is that in Heaven, things are kind of outside of time since everyone is immortal and time doesn’t have the same meaning, but it does exist, even if you’re kind of outside of it.
So, after doing the dishes, Naybriel suggests that they go down to the beach and look around for a while. They have a long conversation about what kinds of clothes that people should wear for cool weather, which comes off as weird, even though I know that she’s doing it because her angels aren’t aware of physical touch. After nearly two months of sitting around contemplating their navels, you’d think that they’d noticed that when it’s cold, you wear more clothing.
\~/
I feel like Adornetto actually wanted to start this book the moment that the angels landed, but then her agent (or her parents) thought it was a bad idea for some reason, and she just decided to write the same basic things anyways. Editors really should have gotten this, but apparently, this thing turned their brains to mush at some point. I wonder…is this some kind of unknown weapon that could make people overlook extremely obvious code or something. Unfortunately, I doubt it could ever be utilized since it would work both ways.
Moving on, they go down to the beach, and we get a long description of just how perfect the whole thing is with
pearly shells, fragments of glass worn smooth by the motion of the water, the occasional half buried sandal or an abandoned shovel, and tiny white crabs that scuttled in and of little pea sized holes in rock pools.
\~/
I think that the crab that she is referring to here is mictyris longicarpus or the Australian soldier crab which looks like
and is about an inch wide. It’s apparently a popular crab there. It also seems to like places like Singapore, so we still don’t have the clearest of ideas of where Venus Cove is. Also, I would be willing to bet that, even if she had a mind to place Venus Cove in America, she’d never consider if these kinds of crabs lived there.
The description goes on, and Bethany thinks about how she never had all these sensations before, and I’m starting to consider giving a drink count for the times that she makes Heaven sound like a stinky place to go.
Then, in a rare moment of action, Bethany splashes Ivy with her foot which starts a splash fight between the two while Naybriel watches on benevolently.
This is for all practical purposes like watching someone else’s kids on the beach. It’s clear that they’re having fun, but as the reader, I don’t really care about it. The real problem is that while it’s clever to have the people bonding together and slowly becoming more human, it’s boring. If Adornetto had wanted a scene like this, it could have easily have been done between her and her human friends. It could have shown a contrast between people and her, and it might have really been interesting to show that Bethany was becoming more human from interacting with humans. As it is, it just feels like Bethany and Ivy are idiots and Naybriel is wondering how he had offended the Almighty enough to get landed with babysitting the pair.
Then she jumps on Naybriel’s back and rides him for a while.
\~/
…
You know, there is an ocean of subtext in this gesture, but I’m not going to touch it. There’s enough of it between Molly and Bethany without bringing Naybriel in for a threesome.
They play around, Naybriel dumps Bethany in the water, which I enjoy far too much for my own good, and they all act like five-year-olds.
Somewhere, not far from here, a demon just convinced someone to commit suicide. His name was Bob, and he’d been looking for a job. He had a loving wife and two children, both of whom will experience shame, guilt and poverty. This will possibly begin a chain of abuse and misery that will affect their future families and possibly even land them in hell. These three clowns could have prevented all that.
While they are enjoying their bliss, Bethany notices a woman with a kid who is still hanging around.
The child, who couldn’t have been more than five or six, ran up to her mother tearfully. There was a swelling on the child’s plump arm, probably the result of an insect bite, which she had further inflamed by rubbing. The child cried even harder while the mother rummaged in her bag for some ointment. She brought out a tube of aloe gel, but could calm her wriggling daughter enough to apply it.
Then Ivy sticks her nose into things and starts to examine the bite, which the mother “looked grateful” for. My sister has a daughter who is four. I highly doubt that she was be grateful about some strange woman getting involved if her kid was upset because she was hurt. Unless the kid just broke her arm, it doesn’t require angelic assistance.
And need I remind everyone that there are children in regions of the world that have serious medical conditions?
\~/ \~/
Ivy takes the woman’s gel, heals the bit, the kid is very twee and asks if Ivy used magic, and the mother watches the bite fade away to nothing, even though it was inflamed, and is just confused.
\~/
When the mother asks what’s going on, Ivy gives us this…stunning piece of stupidity
“Amazing what science can do these days.”
No.
Many times, no.
Gel doesn’t do that. Nothing does that, and this woman would presumably have the sense to see through that argument. Science is rational. Science has laws. Even if we’re discussing things in a confirmed Christian worldview where you have powers that can break the laws of science without thinking about it, we can’t. And we notice when things do not obey our rules. People are not stupid, Adornetto.
Next, do not bring science into this story. Your very setting is physically impossible.
\~/ \~/ \~/
Also, Adornetto, I would like to introduce you to Amaterasu from Okami. In this game, Amaterasu technically speaking goes around feeding the woodland creatures, making flowers grow and helping people with their day to day problems, yet this game is ten times more interesting than your angels healing the cuts of random kids who are only going to get bit again eventually anyways.
Why don’t you try to think about why?
\~/
So, after that little interlude, they start walking around again and the downtown of Venus is described as being like every other ideal version of a downtown ever made.
The town center was a quaint place, full of antique shops, and cafes that served tea and iced cakes on mismatched china.
These places don’t seem to want to stay in business in an area this pretentious. And I hate the word ‘quaint’. It just drips with ego. Personally, I don’t think that Adornetto really understand the subtext of the word ‘quaint’ as ‘backwards or outdated’ but it’s also not really an excuse.
\~/ \~/
In America, we don’t have town centers. The center of town is not particularly important, and sometimes even when the center used to be important in the original plan of the city, it isn’t after a while.
Now, people could say that judging by the signs, she’s talking about a place in Australia, so this would be fine. The problem is that she hasn’t said that she’s talking about Australia, and all the links I’ve made are conjecture. For all I know, she’s just assuming that everywhere is run like Australia, and set this place in America. She doesn’t tell anyone.
In Harry Potter, we knew pretty much at the beginning where the story was placed, and if you didn’t know then, you knew by the third chapter. Even _Twilight was clear on where the place was. Adornetto seems to think that if she’s vague, she can make this be anywhere, and she can’t.
Oh, just so you know, we’re five pages into this chapter.
Fun times, ya’ll.
While they’re walking around the downtown for no discernible reason, Bethany hears someone calling “Beth” and sees Molly waving to her.
She was wearing a backless halter dress, which was completely inappropriate given the weather, and was perched on the lap of a boy with sun bleached hair and tropical board shorts. His broad hands were stroking her bare back in long rhythmic strokes.
And thus she’s a slut. And the sentence with the guy gives me the mental image of something kind of similar to the awkward face petting in Twilight.
\~/ \~/
I hate slut shaming. Particularly when there is no reason for it. Molly is doing nothing wrong. If she were of a religion that frowned on this kind of thing and did this as a means of rebellion that was different than the norm of her society, then maybe there would be grounds for raised eyebrows, but she isn’t. She isn’t claiming to be. She’s doing nothing dirty by wearing a dress that makes her look good and sitting on a guy’s lap, and in a beach town, a backless halter dress isn’t what one would call shocking.
Molly is unaware that her friend is looking at her with scorn and considers her to be a sinful little lost sheep, and waves to her, obviously wanting to talk to Bethany and meet everyone. Ivy and Naybriel look unhappy that they have to –come in contact with the plebs- go talk to Molly.
Both she and Gabriel knew that to blatantly ignore her would contravene the laws of courtesy.
…
Adornetto, you are aware that I’m supposed to like these characters, right? You know…I don’t even have to say anything, the arrogance of the idea that the only reason that they would deign to speak to a young girl who seemed to really consider one of your special little group as a friend purely out of courtesy speaks for itself.
\~/
But who cares, I’ve got some more drinks on the way!
When Bethany and the others come and see her the “surfer” looks “peeved” when Molly “extricates” herself and goes up to them, but he quickly starts lusting after Ivy. And that’s fine. \~/
Bethany introduces her ‘family’ to Molly, and Molly starts crushing on Naybriel since he’s so hawt. And she
only just managed to stammer a hello before coyly averting her eyes.
Never use ‘coy’ again, Bethany. It somehow sounds dirty coming from you.
Naybriel bows slightly to Molly, which is weird, and even Bethany knows is weird, and Molly is all overwhelmed, which Ivy and Bethany pity her for. It’s only natural to be overwhelmed in the presence of your betters after all!
\~/
Then things take another nose dive into the land of stupid. As if they couldn’t possibly go any further. We’re now reaching, in the ocean of stupid, the Midnight Zone. Things haven’t quite reached the Abyss yet.
Two dudes come out of a pub and seem to be getting ready to brawl for no apparent reason, even though it seems a little early in the day for drunken shenanigans, since there’s still light out.
Yeah, this scene comes out of absolutely nowhere? Why do you ask?
I suppose that I should be grateful. After all something is happening. It has nothing to do with the plot, and it really doesn’t make sense, but it is something, and it is happening.
Taking another trip into the land of You Wasted a Perfectly Good Plot, this might have worked. This might have been something to signify that there was a demonic influence on the town, particularly if the others watching were looking amused by the whole thing. This would show that at some level there was a very evil undercurrent to the whole town, and it would have even been slightly creepy, which as we’re dealing with demons, would work nicely.
As it is, if you want to read about demons who really play their part of mind rape and horror, go read some creepypasta.
Mostly people go into the pub where the fight started, for some reason. Naybriel, being a good man, stands in front of Bethany and Ivy, but not Molly, who is actually human and actually defenseless. I’m going to assume that Boyfriend (hey, he doesn’t even have a name) tried to get her to go somewhere else, but Molly wanted to make sure that her friend was alright, since it looked like Naybriel was going to be macho.
\~/
A look of repulsion flitted across Gabriel’s usual impassive face.
As the dudes start duking it out. Since in this continuity, Naybriel is supposed to be a warrior, I highly doubt that he should be disgusted by the fact that people are fighting. Maybe it’s because they’re drunk?
Of course not! It’s the fact that they’re lowly humans who sin! While I wouldn’t think that angels have the greatest patience with people, it’s best not to just have him be flat disgusted with us. It means I don’t like him.
Another problem is that he waits for someone to get beat up and start “oozing blood” before deciding to get involved. Naybriel stands in front of the guys and they decide that he wants to fight too, or rather
\~/ (<- preemptive drink)
Enraged by the interference, the two men joined forces and now hello sudden tense shift from past to present directed their combined anger at Gabriel. They swung wildly at him but every punch failed to find its mark. Yet, Gabriel had not moved. Eventually both men tired and slumped to the ground their chests heaving with the effort.
Because Naybriel is Cooler Than You.
Problem: Angels can be hit. How do we know this? Because Jacob fought with one in the Old Testament. It dislocated his knee, but he still fought it and managed to get him on the ground.
\~/
So, Naybriel tells the two guys to scram, somehow Naybriel’s voice “has a sobering effect” due to his authority.
I know a lot of people who would like that. I would like that to bring to a party. Imagine: a group of half naked drunk people belting out bad karaoke, and then someone takes out a recording of Naybriel’s voice, and suddenly, everyone is stone cold sober.
THE SHAME! I would want to ssseeeeee it.
So, the drunks wander off, likely to get fight somewhere else where they can have some peace and quiet, and Molly “gushes” because she’s a human and thus stupid. Then she asks an utterly moronic question.
“Are you like a karate expert or something?”
Molly, Naybriel didn’t move. He didn’t dodge. He did nothing that would bring martial arts to mind. He essentially stood there and somehow no punch landed on him. This is not karate. This is weird, and you should know this.
But as stupid as this is, Naybriel’s response takes the cake.
“I’m a pacifist,” he said. “There’s no honor in violence.”
…
First of all, that doesn’t make a lot of sense in response to that question. Second of all…
WELL, IT KIND OF STINKS FOR YOU SINCE YOU’RE SUPPOSED TO BE A WARRIOR, DOESN’T IT?! AND IF YOU DON’T BELIEVE IN FIGHTING THAT WHAT DO YOU THINK THAT YOU’RE DOING COMING DOWN FROM HEAVEN TO FIGHT DEMONS?
Unless of course you’re lying. Which with these ‘angels’ I wouldn’t be surprised.
\~/ \~/ \~/
Calms Down
Molly, naturally doesn’t know what to say to that since it doesn’t really make sense. Molly essentially asked how Naybriel did what he did, he told her he was a pacifist. I know I’m going back to this, but it just doesn’t make sense.
Sidestepping the general lack of sense that this is making, Molly offers Bethany a taste of her ice cream.
Maybe I should start a drink count for the amount of subtext going on between Bethany and Molly. \~/
I need a subtext gif…
Before I could object, she leaned over and shoved her outstretched spoon into my mouth. Immediately something cold and slippery began dissolving on my tongue. It seemed to be shifting shape—transforming from velvety solid to liquid that trickled down my throat. The cold made my head ache there should be a comma here and I swallowed as quickly as I could.
Bethany with brainfreeze.
Consider that for a moment.
Now, I do have to say one thing, why is it that Molly assumes that Bethany’s never had ice cream before and thus offers her some? We know that Bethany’s not from around here, but she just assumes that she’s moved in from somewhere that is also wealthy. It just makes no sense.
Bethany says she likes it, and Molly, clearly wanting to hang out with her and continue in some kind of threesome with Boyfriend, gets ready to order her some. Naybriel says no, and they have to go home. Molly seems disappointed and then gives Bethany some of the lip gloss that she’d liked in the third chapter.
Seriously, Adornetto? I can give you more textual evidence that Molly has a crush on Bethany than your true love.
And somehow the fact that Nabriel and Ivy “exchange meaningful looks” all the way back amuses me. It makes me think that they’re thinking something like “Uh huh, this is getting interesting.”
That night, Bethany feels the urge to exposit about how she looks again, mentioning that in “the Kingdom” as she calls it, (which is really stupid) you can’t see yourself, so she’s transfixed by her reflection. I believe that that’s called vanity and is a subset of pride.
Drink up.
\~/
Now, credit where it’s due, this is the only time I’ve seen a scene where the character looks in the mirror to describe themselves having a logical reason. This is a cliché, and most of the time it doesn’t work since it seems strange that the character has to see themselves in the mirror. For Bethany, there’s a practical reason: she’s not used to seeing herself, since she doesn’t actually have a body, and is honestly curious about it. That works.
What doesn’t work is how Bethany describes herself.
Compared to the other girls at Venus Cove, I knew I must look strange. My skin was alabaster pale while they still sported tans from the summer. My eye were wide and brown; my pupils hugely dilated what is the point of this statement?. Molly and her friends looked like they never tired of experimenting with their hair, but mine was parted in the middle and fell in chestnut waves. I had a full, coral colored mouth which, I was later to learn, could give the impression that I was sulking.
Oh hai, Bella!
Oh, and drink for trashing the other girls for doing things with their hair while you’re pure and natural and allow yourself to look like the little Purity Sue that you are. \~/
As I said, the problem was how she spoke about herself. First person is really hard this way. A character can’t really describe what they look like without sounding strange. Now, there are ways around it. For instance, in the Dresden Files, which I heartily recommend to anyone who wants to see a good use of first person or just a good story, Harry Dresden often describes himself, usually in unflattering terms, when comparing himself to other people, usually in the negative. This not only shows us what Harry looks like in general terms, it also gives us a view on Harry’s vision of himself, and actually makes you like him more.
That’s the point of first person, to convey aspects of the character that might not easily have been able to be shown in third. It isn’t so that you can put yourself into the character’s shoes. It’s often a really good point of view to use when dealing with introverted characters or characters who hide a lot about themselves.
It’s not easy to do, and when you do it badly, you make it seem like all first person writers are hacks who are really just pretending to be the characters and talking about how awesome they are.
After describing herself to us, because we needed to know that Bethany’s eyes are dilated. (I now have an image of Bethany the Lemur.) She changes into pajamas with dancing cows on them. She mentions how the other girls wouldn’t be caught dead wearing that (\~/) and that Naybriel apparently was given a pair just like it with sailboats that he never wears.
Score for Naybriel. At least he has some self-respect.
She mentions describes how obnoxiously pretentious the whole house is again, and since I’ve been debating how much money I would need to live in a small apartment with a roommate after saving up my stipend for the next two years for furniture, I am consider how much money the blasted thing would cost, and it annoys me. I know that this is essentially Adornetto’s wish-fulfillment fantasy, but honestly, not only is it insulting to the holy beings that she’s claiming to writing from the perspective of, but she’s also insulting anyone who can’t necessarily afford this kind of house, like many of her readers.
Also, you know what, I’m counting her racism under that ‘thinks something’s good when it really isn’t’ count.
\~/ \~/ \~/ \~/ \~/
(To make up for lost time)
Also, the fact that angels don’t need a lot of sleep is brought up, and that they actually don’t need to sleep much, and apparently Naybriel and Ivy like to talk deep into the night while Bethany sleeps. Even though they have the energy to at least be looking for demons.
From Wiki:
Sloth is defined as spiritual or emotional apathy, neglecting what God has spoken, and being physically and emotionally inactive.
\~/
Then things get weird. I’m going to do a passage spork because this is honestly…creepy. I mean, it manages to actually be slightly creepier than Edward Cullen going “I watch you sleeping.” and Bella going “THAT IS SO ROMANTIC!”.
While she’s sitting in bed, looking up at the ceiling, Bethany
imagined a stranger coming in my room.
I’ve had nightmares about this two. Usually accompanied by lights refusing to stay on and being alone in the house…wait…you mean that this is supposed to be good?
I felt his weight as he sat on the edge of my bed in silence.
First of all, how does she knew that it’s male? Her eyes are closed.
Second of all.
\~/
Get me out of your head when you’re having rape fantasies.
I was sure that he was watching me as I slept, but I didn’t dare open my eyes because I knew he would prove to be a figment of my imagination, and I wanted the illusion to continue a little longer.
And here is where Adornetto falls into Meyer land. Now, as a Twihard, she’s of the opinion that a man watching a woman sleeping is romantic.
Now, I have a personal story for all of you. When my sister was eighteen and just starting college, she went up to Virginia on a ski trip and ended up breaking her leg. While she was in the hospital, a young man who had been skiing with her visited frequently. He was obviously attracted to her, and I found the whole thing faintly amusing (like most younger sisters). That was until one night, when my sister was drugged on morphine I came into the hospital room to get my Gameboy, which I had left, to see that he had come after visiting hours were over.
The guy was leaning over my sister, watching her breathing while she was in a drugged sleep. It was not, in any way, shape, or form, romantic. My sister was completely defenseless, and he knew it. I’m not sure what would have happened if I hadn’t come in there, but after he saw me, and knew that my sister’s family hadn’t completely left, he left the room pretty quickly.
My dad spent the night in her room with her, and told the nurses about what happened. We didn’t see him again.
Now, in the view of Meyer and Adornetto, what this guy was doing was totally romantic and a sign of his love and desire to protect my sister. My family and I were monsters for not allow that truest of true young loves to exist.
I have a very low tolerance for this viewpoint.
When a person does this to someone else, it is a sign of possession and of power. The person sleeping is at the mercy of the person watching. The person watching can do whatever they want, and the person sleeping will not be able to react in time. Now, there are times when this can be romantic. Say when the person is hurt, there is no medical care, and the person is keeping a vigil over that other person to make sure that things don’t get worse. Also, there is usually a romance established already. \~/
There is no romance established between Bethany and Xavier yet. She’s just having random fantasies about him. Oh. Spoilers.
The boy lifted his hand to brush a wisp of hair out of my eyes and then leaned forward to kiss my forehead. His kiss was like being touched by butterfly wings.
vomits
Adornetto, how do you manage to go from creepy rape fantasies to tastes like diabetes in the space of three seconds?
I felt no alarm; I knew I could just this stranger with my life.
Well, that makes everything better. As long as you know in your heart that the guy is a good guy, everything’s going to be just fine. After all, no one ever really falls in love with a bad person.
The chapter ends as Dream!Xavier wishes Bethany good night, and she falls asleep to the sound of the waves, like a good heroine.
What was the point of that? Seriously, did the editor think that we needed more Xavier since that was the reason for the whole stinking book? Oh, and by the way, this here, is a Big Lipped Alligator Moment. It will never be relevant to the plot, and if it is mentioned again, it’s so passing that I didn’t even notice it on my first read.
Frankly, these last two chapters could have easily been condensed and cut out. While it’s good to see the angels doing things somewhat like what angels are supposed to do, like heal people and all, it doesn’t make much sense to begin with. The whole thing seemed jammed in yet slow and boring. It’s like someone is telling Adornetto that she needs to slow down and work on the plot, but as far as she’s concerned the romance and the fact that Bethany’s an angel, ya’ll, is the plot. Thus she can’t advance it.
Stay tuned for a new pointless chapter, in which we meet more stereotypes, and I get more offended!
Drink count: 30
lilyWhite on 24 July 2013, 22:13 said:
I had an idea for how this story could actually be good:
Bethany et a(nge)l(s). come down from Heaven because of a Dark (read: “sinful”) Influence on Venus Cove. And while there are some cases of destructive behaviour, Bethany notices some people doing things that the other angels attribute to the Dark Influence that…don’t actually seem that bad. Such as Molly being flirtatious. Over time, Bethany realizes that some of these things that people are doing under the Dark Influence are actually quite harmless and the people seem to be happy because of these things, and that the angels she came with are assholes when it comes to people straying from the Light (read: what God says is good). Bethany realizes that while complete indulgence in all Dark/“sinful” things is still bad, unstraying devoting to all Light/“virtuous” things can motivate people to do just as terrible things. Therefore, Bethany rebels to bring balance between Light and Dark, driving out the demons while keeping the angels from going too far. This would also include Bethany realizing that Molly is coming onto her and accepting that she feels attracted to Molly, enjoys Molly’s company a lot, and that there’s nothing wrong with Molly’s behaviour.
It might deviate a bit from angel mythology, but it’s not like the book as it is now cares all that much about actual lore. (Also because I like lesbian romance and when “Light” and “Dark” are not invariably good and evil respectively.) Then again, the plot is more-or-less an afterthought thrown on top of a crappy paranormal romance…
Pryotra on 24 July 2013, 22:48 said:
The problem is that that mythology happens to tied to three rather large, currently in practice religions with lots of practitioners who are going to feel alienated, or even offended, by going into the “light (God) is not good” angle. Particularly those who wouldn’t necessarily see a relationship between Molly and Bethany as being sinful.
I see what you’re trying to do, and it would probably be the best idea to distance the book from religion a tad somehow. Maybe by not making them really angels or something and just the self-proclaimed Agents of Light and Goodness.
Honestly, I hate all books involving romance with angels. It just seems pointless to me.
Asahel on 24 July 2013, 23:39 said:
So, why is it that a boy touching Molly’s back is bad, but having a fantasy about a boy kissing Bethany’s forehead is not bad? I’m just sensing a double standard here.
A bit? Have you heard about Olympus Mons on Mars? It’s a bit of a climb, I’d say. I agree with Pryotra, religious people don’t usually appreciate “God is not good” books. But, I don’t think the problem is that Adornetto needed to distance her book from religion more—it’s that she distanced it from religion way too much. She wants a romance book with angels? Ok, but you have to deal with the consequences of that. If Bethany really does fall for Xavier, she will really Fall for Xavier. Unfortunately, that doesn’t fit the nice little supernatural romance template.
Pryotra on 25 July 2013, 09:17 said:
That’s the problem. I would love to see this story. It would be a rather interesting horror subversion to the template, and it would be an interesting tragedy. Since through her own selfishness and such, Bethany lost everything, whereas if she had been patient, there would have likely come a time where she and Xavier could have been extremely close, only without the physical intimacy.
Unfortunately, as you said, it would never match the template. That’s basically why I say to distance it so that they’re not really angels. It doesn’t fix the problem though.
Truthfully, I can’t think of any way to keep with the Paranormal Romance template in this book and NOT have a problem.
Brendan Rizzo on 25 July 2013, 11:52 said:
I’ve been waiting for this one. Bethany is one of the least likeable characters I’ve ever come across, and that’s saying something. So every update of this spork brings joy to my heart.
Don’t you mean one-dimensional? Badumtish.
Did that really happen in the book, or did you just make that up?
To be fair, (geez I’ve been the Devil’s Advocate for these people a lot lately) I would easily imagine that angels are often annoyed by human beings’ tendency to sin.
Hmm… I wonder what this story’s (and thus Adornetto’s) views on homosexual relationships are.
I’m probably missing something here, but where is she racist? Is it just because she’s unhealthily pale but thinks that’s the height of beauty?
How can Adornetto possibly fail to see how sinful her little Self-Insert is? Even if Bethany were a well-rounded character, she would still be a Mary Sue because no matter what she does, the author thinks she’s perfect.
Oh my gosh, that’s horrible. It’s a good thing you were there.
And now I want to slap this author. Is she incapable of viewing this objectively? I am beginning to think that Adornetto is mentally challenged.
Brendan Rizzo on 25 July 2013, 11:56 said:
Yeah, no one’s denying that, but that doesn’t mean that no one should ever be allowed to write such books. It’s not like the authors would actually believe that such is the case, and even if they did, so what? That wouldn’t really affect anybody’s religious beliefs. (Besides, the very notion of including God in a work of fiction opens up a philosophical can of worms all on its own. Incorporating heterodox ideas into the story won’t make it any worse.)
We’re here to criticize bad writing, not to bash plots we don’t like.
Pryotra on 25 July 2013, 16:09 said:
True, but it wouldn’t hurt if Adornetto said “irritated” and not “repulsed”. It’s subtext again that basically Naybriel is looking down on the two and sneering that he has to be involved, and if Adnornetto really wants to take that angle, she really needs to at least write something where Angels are Not Necessarily Good.
Chances are, if she thinks about it at all, it’s something about it being inferior to her view of true love. Or if she ever decides to write about a gay/lesbian couple, she might go on and on about how their love is somehow more pure and more true than any straight couple could ever experience.
Rather like a lot of slash and femslash writers on ff.net.
It’s that she keeps harping on it every time she describes, and if there is a person who might be black, she makes them into a total idiot. It kind of reminds me of SMeyer’s claim that becoming a vampire automatically makes you white and thus beautiful.
She’s a normal, slightly over romantic teenage girl who just happened to have a name where she could write her self indulgent fantasies. She’s influenced by Twilight and it’s view of love, but she has published before this. There’s nothing mentally wrong with her that few courses in creative writing with my teachers wouldn’t have fixed.
Besides, it’s terrible form to attack the mental capability of the writer. We don’t know her, and it’s rude to make personal comments. Comments on the bad writing, yes, comments about how we feel about her using religion in this trainwreck, yes, just not about her as a person.
bq.(Besides, the very notion of including God in a work of fiction opens up a philosophical can of worms all on its own. Incorporating heterodox ideas into the story won’t make it any worse.)
Er…yes and no…
There’s a large difference between something like the many mainstream works that involve angels (It’s a Wonderful Life) and deliberately going on the offensive. While works that attack Christianity certainly shouldn’t be censored, I think that they should be treated as what they are. Rather like Christian Fiction is Christian Fiction, not mainstream.
Pryotra on 25 July 2013, 19:06 said:
Another idea with lilywhite’s premise might be that the angels themselves don’t necessarily interpret ‘sinful’ right, and thus rail against things that aren’t necessarily wrong, like how they’re going to whine about people watching TV at some point, and such.
Thus making it a little more ambiguity and raising questions about if this or that was what God meant or what people interpreted something to mean. Which is how a lot of adult fiction manages to make stances on religion without necessarily offending someone.
Such as we have a pretty confirmed existence of God in The Dresden Files, and yet things are handled in a way that work for the plot, aren’t necessarily offensive, but also allow Butcher to have a Fallen, or a Shadow of a Fallen, actually do something good.
I’m sorry if I sounded at all irritated in the last post. I’ve been tired and a little stressed lately.
Asahel on 25 July 2013, 21:08 said:
I see what you mean now. The thing is, they’re already not really angels (as you point out with all the mortal sins as well as the moniker Naybriel), so, sure, I guess one way of doing it would be to go the whole way and make them some kind of spiritual beings, but not call them angels. Personally, I would prefer to see more real angels in literature. I don’t even mind angelic romance, but it would either have to deal with the consequences (as I mentioned before) or be a Platonic relationship that perhaps the angel is tempted with (of course, that would mean the plot would have to be more than just the romance).
That’s actually another one of the things that makes me feel they’re angels in name only. Look at how God and godly people react to sinners in the Bible. Jeremiah is called the weeping prophet because he was called to preach doom on Jerusalem for their sins. He knew they deserved it and God had put up with their idolatry far longer than they deserved, but he was still sad about it. God criticized Jonah for wishing destruction on Ninevah and not wanting to preach to them because they might repent and God would have mercy (which is what happened). God criticized the attitude of a person gleefully awaiting the punishment of the sinner!
So, yes, sin is bad, but if God loved the sinners enough to send Jesus into the world to die as the sacrifice for sin that we couldn’t make for ourselves, shouldn’t God’s angels have the same love for those that Jesus bled and died for? Basically, angels seeing humans in sin should be like us seeing someone wearing filthy rags: we shouldn’t hate the person because they’re wearing filthy rags; instead we should want to offer them clean clothes or a good washing.
Believe me, I’m the last person to advocate banning books. I meant it more from a “know your target audience” standpoint. It just seems to me that if someone were writing an angelic romance story, religious types might be the main target and the author shouldn’t want to annoy his/her target audience. On the other hand, if someone felt he/she could aim it more at the gnostic and atheist audiences that would enjoy a story thumbing its nose at God, I suppose that’s up to the author.
Well said.
Sorry to hear. I hope you can get some rest and stress relief soon!
Brendan Rizzo on 26 July 2013, 09:05 said:
…Now that you put it that way, I see your point. I was thinking that there had to be something wrong with her if she thought that a boy watching a girl sleep is romantic, but I understand that I shouldn’t have implied that she has a genuine mental problem. I apologize— in fact, I should have been the last person to make such an accusation! (But that’s another story.)
I didn’t mean “attack Christianity”, I meant taking some artistic license. People do this with religion all the time. If it’s clear that the author isn’t implying that the story is reality, I see no problem with this.
That said, the idea of angels falling in love with humans is rather heterodox in itself… lemme just say that I highly doubt that angels (since they’re basically a Platonic ideal being made manifest) would have any romantic desires. But of course Adornetto throws logic out the window for her stupid plot. I want to see some realistic consequences, but we can’t have that, can we? After all, this is a teenage girl’s fantasy that really should never have been published, for her own good. Once you get published, the success can go to your head (not to mention that if your mediocre stuff sells enough, you perversely acquire protection from editors so that you never improve). Any talent Adornetto may have developed is now stunted. And that’s terrible.
Master Chief on 27 July 2013, 01:32 said:
I am using the Bethany/Molly action as a guide for writing a lesbian relationship in my fanfic. Thank you Adornetto.
Juracan on 27 July 2013, 11:20 said:
Worse than that, though, even if this woman DID buy that, then she’d come to expect the gel to have the same effect every time there’s an insect bite. Science, generally speaking, works because it is consistent— if it doesn’t fix the next bug bite the same way, then the woman knows for a fact that something’s up. Which might not be so bad, if it weren’t for the fact that these angels are apparently staying in the same town for a long duration of time.
Yeah.
So the guys just wear themselves out and then leave when asked? That’s…. stupid. Well, actually, that’s a fairly smart reaction, but that’s not how a drunk guy would act. He might act bewildered and confused, or he might get angrier and try to figure out how to actually hurt him.
Also, why would she have a fantasy about a guy watching her sleep? That seems… really odd, all things considered. Wouldn’t she sleep easier fantasizing about their mission going off without a hitch or something?
lilyWhite on 27 July 2013, 13:49 said:
I suspect part of it is because writers like Adornetto and Meyer, writing the self-insert romance fantasies that they’re writing, don’t see anything wrong with the love interest watching their self-insert sleep because they’ve already decided that the love interest is the perfect guy. They know (well, I suppose it would be better to say that they think) that the love interest isn’t some random guy who is going to do anything wrong to them, but readers would see that the character and the love interest have no relationship and that what amounts to slightly more than a random guy watching the girl sleep is gross.
Two words: crappy romance. The “plot” isn’t the important part of the story, it’s the romance.
Which further paints Bethany as a pathetic being in any light, putting more focus on random crap and the love interest than saving people like she was tasked to do.
Brendan Rizzo on 27 July 2013, 16:15 said:
Just wondering, considering all the uniquely Australian aspects of the setting, was it ever confirmed that Venus Cove was not in Australia? That seems to be what you’ve been assuming, but can you back it up?
swenson on 27 July 2013, 17:35 said:
I legitimately forgot his name in the book wasn’t actually Naybriel until this point.
Wow. That is… almost hilarious in how much of the Bible it ignores. Jesus was pacifistic the first time around. There’s nothing really indicating angels were or are… and regardless of your interpretation of the end times, most Christian eschatologists would agree that at some point in the future, Jesus will return with a pack of angels, and He will not be handing out lollipops.
Keep this spork up, though. I do love it, and all its stupidity regarding angels. :3
Pryotra on 27 July 2013, 17:53 said:
Pretty much, yeah. That’s a huge problem with these authors. An action is good or bad because they say so, and they don’t expect the readers to read into the action or apply it to anything else. After all, they said it was a good thing. This is why they fail at interpreting literary fiction so hard. They read the text, see that so and so is saying that he loves the girl, but don’t read into the subtleties that show that he doesn’t.
It’s not necessarily what I’m assuming. I’m pointing out the setting because she describes it weird and never says where it is.
1. The setting is impossible.
2. The windmills that she describes as ‘quaint’ there is nothing quaint about the windmills that I’ve looked up.
3. She never specifies. Most people, even Suethors, like to say what continent the characters are on.
4. I’m pretty sure that she’s actually trying on purpose not to specify so that Venus Cove could be anywhere.
lol. Well, it might as well be…
What’s ridiculous is that this is common knowledge. Everyone knows about fire and brimstone speeches, even if you’re not Christian. She doesn’t really have an excuse, but I suppose it makes the whole thing more funny. Just wait until we hear the views on hell…
Nate Winchester on 27 July 2013, 21:17 said:
And now you know why my stuff ends up at a breakneck pace. XD I usually don’t have a problem with action beats, I have to work at putting in moments to breath.
First time I read this, I thought you meant the demon’s name was Bob and he was looking for a job… etc.
I feel bad for having laughed the first time.
Well also see CS Lewis’ miracles, where he points out that even when such does happen, the powers more “bend” the laws of the universe and then follow them on from there. Such as the virgin conception of Jesus. Miracle at first, but then (as far as we know) he still had to gestate for nine months, then get born, be potty trained, etc etc. There’s even a pslam (I think, can’t recall off the top of my head) that God delights in His laws (of reality) and desires them upheld.
Uh… may depend on where you are. I know I’ve been to several small burgs in Kentucky that really do have a sort of traditional “town center”. I guess depends on how big/small the place is.
Well that sounds like another sign this is Australia.
I’d laugh if he was actually disgusted more by their techniques. “Oh my, that is completely the improper defense for this terrain. I can’t believe he didn’t take that opening!” etc
Some ways I can see it done:
1) Genesis traditional – When humans & angels do it, it doesn’t result in anything good for humanity.
2) The truly alien – Like what Chuck mentions about the plant in this video. (http://sfdebris.com/videos/startrek/d544.asp around the 4 min mark) Or to quote the old joke: “Anything better than sex, God kept for Himself.” Thus the angels, being from Heaven, don’t really grasp or “get” the act of sex. Or they have an alternate that’s even more intense, intimate, etc (like the Changeling’s great link).
3) The overly religious – I’ll defer more to Catholics on this but I’m thinking that the angels see more of the “spiritual” side of the act so for them to engage in it, they have to do elaborate rites (aka a marriage ceremony on steroids) to “prep” for it. They might even have some appreciation for the act as some kind of “gateway for new souls” but then be horrified at fornication, adultery, etc.
“Behold! I have come to dispense lollipops and ass-kickings! And I’m all out of lollipops…”
Pryotra on 27 July 2013, 21:44 said:
That would have been great. And he would have complained about it all the way back, since he’s sort of a snob when it comes to proper fighting as opposed to being a snob in general.
All of which give extremely good reasons why this romance is full of fail. I’d go for all three.
Well, I’ll admit, I’m not overly the biggest fan of Lewis, but I sort of agree. But at the same time, I think it’s more voluntarily going with the rules. Kind of like a good author doesn’t randomly break their own rules. Even if, technically, there’s no one that can get upset about it. At the same time, there are definite breakages, such as making “the sun stop” during a battle so it can keep on going, and creation.
Maybe it depends on what you call ‘breaking’ and what you call ‘bending’.
Juracan on 29 July 2013, 14:31 said:
Well yes, but I was kind of hoping there was more lead-in than that.
…stupid YA romance authors, killing my hope for humanity.