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  1.  

    More precisely, when is it okay for a character on the “good guys”’ side to be exponentially more powerful than the protagonist during the course of the story—i.e. not a prologue thousands of years ago before the main story where he sealed the antagonist in a can? For instance, Dumbledore was hailed as the most powerful wizard in the HP-verse, but nobody in the wizarding world (besides Voldemort and the Death Eaters) had problems with his power. Why?

  2.  

    Dumbledore was hailed as the most powerful wizard in the HP-verse, but nobody in the wizarding world (besides Voldemort and the Death Eaters) had problems with his power. Why?

    Uh, Ministry of Magic had problems. Fudge was always paranoid about him. That’s like having the US Government freaked out about you.

    • CommentAuthorDanielle
    • CommentTimeMay 27th 2012
     

    Quick question: Does OP stand for Optimus Prime? That’s all I could think of….

    I think it’s okay when it’s handled well. So to my logical mind, that would mean when the incredibly powerful Big Good either dies or is unable to use the full extent of his power. Otherwise, he just ends up looking like a jerk/idiot for not wiping the floor with the baddies at the first opportunity.

    And on a social level, I think Dumblydore got away with being so powerful because he had a reputation for fairness. I think the Slytherins would tell another story, but hey, I’m not a wizard, so what do I know?

  3.  

    It’s okay when it makes narrative sense for it to be like that? I don’t really think there’s a list of specific situations you could make for when it’s okay, or even standard criteria for defining what is “okay” and what is “not okay.” I guess if it does more good than harm for the story than it’s good, and if it does more harm than good it’s bad.

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      CommentAuthorSoupnazi
    • CommentTimeMay 27th 2012
     

    Quick question: Does OP stand for Optimus Prime? That’s all I could think of….

    Overpowered.

    I think it’s okay when it’s a plot point and not just random “this character can swoop in any time and make everything better.” So, do something with it, don’t just have it be.

  4.  

    As long as they have an equally OP weakness to balance things out. Or an enemy/rival/antagonist that’s equally so. Better yet, don’t make them OP; but if they must be, Danielle has the right idea.
    And of course it’s okay if the character in question is a Sue. Being OP is pretty much a requirement for them.

    •  
      CommentAuthorswenson
    • CommentTimeMay 28th 2012
     

    In such a case, there needs to be a reason—and it must be a good one—for why the OP character doesn’t just swoop in and save the day before the plot gets going. Example of how it’s done stupidly: there was as comics story about ten years ago where Gotham City was hit by a severe earthquake. It was mostly evacuated, but then for poorly-explained reasons the US government decided to blockade the city and leave it to its own devices (the story’s called “No Man’s Land” for this reason). Obviously, it quickly falls into anarchy. Concerned, Superman shows up. Now, you’d think Superman could do things like help clear rubble, ferry in food, rescue injured people, rebuild buildings, protect innocent people from the gangs, etc. At the very least, he could coordinate with Batman to help him and the rest of the Batfamily work in Gotham. But no, he essentially shows up, goes “Oh dear, looks like I can’t magically fix everything in a day” and leaves. It’s obvious why this is done (so the problem isn’t solved in ten seconds), but it’s such a stupid reason that it hurts.

    On the other hand, consider Aang from Avatar. He theoretically has ultimate power, but he’s untrained, young, and doesn’t like the idea of killing or even physically hurting others. All of Avatar is about him learning to unlock and control his powers; when he finally does use his powers, he is able to save the day handily (even if he’s clearly still not invincible). This is a great example of a very overpowered character with legitimate reasons for not using all his powers—he doesn’t know how to use them all and he’s somewhat afraid of them anyway.

    Or consider Gandalf from Lord of the Rings. He’s essentially an angel, with immense power. Yet he restricts himself to lighting fires, opening/binding doors, and subtly convincing hobbits to go on random long journeys. Why? Well, because he’s restricted to a mortal body (and therefore doesn’t have access to most of his abilities) and because those who are much higher up than him have forbidden him and the other wizards from using their power in an overt manner against Sauron, in particular because they weren’t ever supposed to rule, just guide. (And what we think of as “magic” isn’t all that powerful in LotR anyway, but that’s a different topic.) (And the Valar are kind of jerks, but I guess they have their reasons.)

    •  
      CommentAuthorFell_Blade
    • CommentTimeMay 29th 2012
     

    I would have to agree with swenson. A character should have a very good reason for being OP in the first place, and an equally good reason for not being able to use their power to magically fix everything wrong with the story. Going back to the Gandalf example, he really didn’t know how powerful he would be against certain foes (particularly the Nazgul) and had to be careful when using his power for fear of attracting too much of Sauron’s attention and then being pursued and overwhelmed.

    Aslan is probably one of my favorite OP characters. He was basically the All Powerful Son of God, and yet he limited himself by his own rules and purposes in each story. Since it was allegorical, it wouldn’t necessarily work as well in another story, but it’s a good example.

    •  
      CommentAuthorswenson
    • CommentTimeMay 29th 2012 edited
     

    As Aslan says in Voyage of the Dawn Treader, “Do you think I wouldn’t obey my own rules?”

    It’s an interesting example, because there’s nobody to force Aslan to obey his own rules and nobody who could truly challenge his power. He deliberately restricted his power (which, obviously, is the point of that part of the allegory). I don’t know if that would work for most characters either, but it goes to show that a character can have even unlimited power and still have restrictions!

    • CommentAuthorDanielle
    • CommentTimeMay 29th 2012
     

    It’s an interesting example, because there’s nobody to force Aslan to obey his own rules and nobody who could truly challenge his power. He deliberately restricted his power (which, obviously, is the point of that part of the allegory). I don’t know if that would work for most characters either, but it goes to show that a character can have even unlimited power and still have restrictions!

    That, of course, fits in with Aslan being the Jesus figure of Narnia. He limits himself, despite having ultimate power, because he refuses to tamper with the free will of the Narnians. That is an excellent reason to have an OP character not use his power: because doing so would be immoral and even cruel. Now, that can only work if it’s done well; as I stated before, I don’t feel it worked with Dumbledore because it seemed more like he was deliberately keeping things from Harry for the sake of keeping things from him. Had he told Harry about the prophecy in Book 3 or 4, it would have made things soooooo much easier…..but, it also would have broken the plot, so whatevs.

    Alice Cullen is another bad example. She can see the freakin’ future, but SMeyer handwaves her role as a Deus Ex Machina by making her powers inconsistently unreliable. So they work sometimes….but not other times….because. Just because.

  5.  

    Alice Cullen is another bad example. She can see the freakin’ future, but SMeyer handwaves her role as a Deus Ex Machina by making her powers inconsistently unreliable. So they work sometimes….but not other times….because. Just because.

    Actually this made sense to me. The future is always changing, based on decisions that people make in the present, which are definitely not set in stone. It also wouldn’t be logical if she were always right.

    •  
      CommentAuthorFell_Blade
    • CommentTimeMay 30th 2012
     

    I just thought of something recently regarding Alice, and I haven’t really seen it anywhere else so I don’t know if it’s been brought up before or not. But did SMeyer’s books explain why Bella is unaffected by Edward, Jane, and the Vulturi’s powers, but Jasper can still influence her mood and Alice can still see her future? If Bella really was immune to the vampires’ powers, none of them should work on her. So far I’ve only seen the movie versions and read the first book, so I wasn’t sure if that was addressed at all in the book (since everyone keeps telling me “The books explain everything SOOOOO much better!”)

    •  
      CommentAuthorswenson
    • CommentTimeMay 30th 2012
     

    Huh. That’s an excellent point. As far as I know, Alice can see Bella’s future… I’m pretty sure that she could see things like Bella jumping off the cliff, etc. So that is an odd thing.

    •  
      CommentAuthorFell_Blade
    • CommentTimeMay 30th 2012
     

    I did start New Moon a while ago (only got a chapter or two in tho) and while they are talking at school about Bella’s birthday she realizes Jasper is controlling her mood too. And I think that happens when they are in the hotel room in Twilight as well. It just seems odd to me that some power will work on her while others don’t. Personally I like the opinion of a youtube reviewer called Smeghead, who said that no one can see Bella’s thoughts because there’s nothing there, and she’s so emo that she doesn’t even notice when Jane is trying to inflict pain. Lol. Anyway, sorry, kinda off topic…