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Writing: When the backstory swallows the story

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    Anyone else have this problem?

    You want to write a story about Jimmy and his amazing adventure. So you set it all up. Turns out, Jimmy has a predecessor named Phil who is now dead after having almost the exact same adventure many years ago. Phil is your backstory. Jimmy (and the reader) must learn Phil’s tragic history before Jimmy can complete his own adventure.

    As you work on Phil’s story, it grows, becomes interesting, characters come to life, and – poof! – suddenly the dead guy who was supposed to be your backstory is more interesting than poor Jimmy. You wrack your brain trying to think of a way to keep Phil in his place. You think maybe you could delete him completely, but that won’t work. You need Phil. Just not so much of him.

    This problem reminds me of the Anakin and Brom story lines. Anakin actually got his prequels and Brom’s story sounds so much more interesting than Eragon’s story really is.

    Anyone else have this happen? What causes it, in your experience? What fixes it, in your experience?

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      CommentAuthorTakuGifian
    • CommentTimeOct 12th 2009 edited
     

    eh… I’ve always had a problem with backstories, but not quite like that. I create several thousand years worth of history for my world, and suddenly I’m more interested in a half-remembred legend than I am about the main story. In this particular case, it’s better to let it burn out, because if the main story is good enough you’ll return to it soon enough. Which I have, thankfully.

    For the situation described above, I’d try to keep to focus on the main character, and his/her feelings, reactions and thoughts regarding the backstory as it is revealed. Also, trotting out a neat little romantic sidequest can helpo to keep thing grounded in the present.

    Not that I advocate ‘trotting out’ side stories as though they were show ponies merely for display, but some people like that method of storytelling. Tell the main story straight and add a bunch of sidequests in the second draft, sort of thing. Anyway, having some reason for the focus to shift back the present and the main characters, like a race against time/circumstance/others/self/nature sort of thing, and remember to the keep the central character in central focus for the majority of the time.

  3.  

    Mine has a reasonably detailed backstory I think(although most of it’s not explicitly explained). It’s mostly related to a countrywide civil war(ala the Warring States period) that ends ~25 years before the story begins. Any characters that are old enough have lived through it were affected somehow, and had fairly unique experiences, which I think is important. Probably gonna tie it into the conspiracy/myth arc thinger if I can.

    According to my betas, it makes the world feel bigger, which pleases me. It’s a pet peeve of mine when fantasy books read like their characters are the center of the universe. My leads are both children of war heroes, so there’s that shadow cast over them, and whenever either meet someone new, that person is likely to say something about “oh you’re _______’s kid, aren’t you?”

    At any rate, I’m sleepy and rambling and didn’t really answer your question. If the backstory has anything to do with your characters, show it to the audience through the prism of said characters, how they view it, and how it affects their own stories. If you can connect your current story in with your backstory(even if it seems more interesting) the reader won’t be able to separate them without trying, and is more likely to just think of the whole thing as interesting.

    Or something, hell, I’m going to bed.

  4.  

    Well, I have two cases similar, I’ll talk about both (sorry all).

    Nagasaki Moon – While there is a large backstory and history to it (sort of) I resolved to keeping the main story focused by having it push everything forward. Yes there’s potentially lots to learn out there but… after you learn it there’s nothing left. It’s what’s happening now, by the people involved in now that matters.

    Mystery Project – I left many “open” avenues here such that I can have fun with lots of backstories even after finishing with the main story. I also find myself “holding off” the backstory, such that the “current” characters are acting and the plot is unfolding without much knowledge about what has gone before. Only close to the end is more revealed and the backstory comes to light revealing that it has had a role in what’s come before but almost no one knew about it.

    That’s my favorite method in fiction. Build up exclusively with your current characters and get the reader thoroughly invested in them. After that, start unfolding the past such that the readers are still intrigued but prefer to stick with the ones they have the most investment in.

    When all else fails, go with prequels and spin-offs. Nothing wrong with that. ;-)

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    “Or something, hell, I’m going to bed.”

    lol

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      CommentAuthorswenson
    • CommentTimeOct 13th 2009
     

    Same thing happened to me once. So I ditched the story and wrote the backstory. shrug It turned out to be substantially more interesting, and once it started developing, it led to some other story ideas that I’m still working out today.

    So… if the backstory has that much potential, why not just write the backstory instead? You can write the original story later.

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    My ganglands story is turning out a little like this. My protags are trying to find out what happened to their parents, which is interesting, but the story of what happened to their parents is also very interesting (although they die in the end). So I might write both.

    The thing is, I have a feeling tthat because of the world it’s set in, this is going to turn into a series that gradually leads to a revolution with different books told from different viewpoints, etc, that mostly focus on the life of whichever character whose viewpoint I have, with the revolution being set in motion in the background. So if I do that, that’s going to be cool. And that wasn’t entirely related to the post, but whatever.

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    No, it was all related, Steph! Thanks.

    Swenson: sounds like you got it figured out. grumbles jealously

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    I think it’s common to have a backstory where the parents/former hero/predecessor died and now the protagonist must carry on the quest.

    When you read stories like this do you think it’s cliche?

  10.  

    When you read stories like this do you think it’s cliche?

    I haven’t seen that in my reading, but then I have a cold and am tired of studying for the PSATs, so I’m probably forgetting some. I don’t think it’s cliche, more a trope.

    eh… I’ve always had a problem with backstories, but not quite like that. I create several thousand years worth of history for my world, and suddenly I’m more interested in a half-remembred legend than I am about the main story. In this particular case, it’s better to let it burn out, because if the main story is good enough you’ll return to it soon enough. Which I have, thankfully.

    I do that, too. I went all the way back to the tribal period for one of my countries, and invented religions and cultures for all of them. Which is OK, but if they’ll only visit the country once in the series and religious violence isn’t a main theme, then it gets to be a little consuming. It’s just so fun to world-build. I do that with characters, too, because building is more fun than using.

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      CommentAuthorEmil 1.4021
    • CommentTimeOct 14th 2009 edited
     
    It's definitely one of my biggest problems when writing and crafting storylines. I tend to get more fond of the minor characters rather than the major ones, so I write them separate storylines, create new side-characters for that purpose, and find myself liking them more. It's a neverending cycle.

    But as has been said before in this thread, if they're worth keeping you will come back to them eventually or find new places to fit them into the storyline. If you create each character with personality enough to be the main, perhaps it's a natural way of fleshing them out? I find it a good thing that you yourself interested in the characters, since it most probably means the readers will be as well. Perhaps that first main character wasn't all that interesting to begin with?
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    When you read stories like this do you think it’s cliche?

    Cliche isn’t always bad. Don’t get too hung up on cliche. Just because something is universally true, doesn’t mean you can’t express it in a new way.

    I think it’s common to have a backstory where the parents/former hero/predecessor died and now the protagonist must carry on the quest.

    Like um… Supernatural? That show has done it wonderfully by having a backstory of the parents have echoing consequences to the present day but the story of the brothers is far greater and more important than the parents.

    Also look at Silmarillion and LotR. Don’t be afraid to have the backstory stand on its own.

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    I think it’s common to have a backstory where the parents/former hero/predecessor died and now the protagonist must carry on the quest.

    When you read stories like this do you think it’s cliche?

    My ganglands story is kind of like that. The protag’s parents were organising a revolution because common thought was that the queen was a pawn, and got so dangerous that they were killed by the queen (who WASN’T a pawn) for it. The protag has to find this out and then ends up disliking the queen—wanting to overthrow her because she’s responsible for the bad conditions of the country AND because she killed the protag’s parents and doesn’t care. So the cause is the same but different. She might go and resurrect old members of the revolution and give them a new cause but the same aim.

    So, no. I’m seriously considering and planning for this, so I don’t think it’s cliche. It’s only cliche if you do it meaninglessly and don’t put a single original thought or slant or twist in there. As it is, the series won’t all be about the revolution directly. Some books will be from different viewpoints and different issues, but all will have the revolution carrying on in the background. I just have to make the bits I include relevant. And find a purpose for writing about these characters in the first place.

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    I’m considering a prequel about the mother of the current main character, who pretty single-handedly caused a whole lot of problems for everyone.

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      CommentAuthorswenson
    • CommentTimeOct 19th 2009
     

    The mother or the main character?

  16.  

    Well, both, I suppose.

    Like mother, like daughter?

    But yeah, that was a confusing sentence.

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      CommentAuthorEmil 1.4021
    • CommentTimeOct 21st 2009 edited
     
    Hm..... My most minor character just took over my ENTIRE PLOT! Now I'm torn between whether to kill of my old major or him...... (There ain't room for the both of them..... Clashing of egos)

    Also, does anyone else experience that when you co-write with others, you tend to like their characters better? (Until she butchered their personality that is..... *sob* And now if feel like the character-social service, wanting to take them away from her....)
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    I have only co-written fanfiction… and the Mary Sue thread… so I can’t really comment on that.

    Wow. Stupid minor characters and their stupid necessity. grumbles

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    Co-writing sounds really, really hard. I’m not sure how anybody does that, for exactly the reason you said.

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    I liked the cowriting I did, though, because when you have no idea what to say, the other person usually does. Plus its crazier.

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      CommentAuthorEmil 1.4021
    • CommentTimeOct 21st 2009 edited
     
    It's probably one of the toughest experiences you will ever have, but I for one found that my writing vastly improved from it.
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    Because you’re trying to outdo each other?

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    No, because you can see all the things the other person does wrong.
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    True. We should cowrite something sometime. When I finish everything I’ve got right now. So probably never.

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    Hm.... I would probably need some recovering from my current cowriting project first, though. She's got me bleeding out of my ears because of my brain imploding. (But she's one of my best friends. so I can't really tell her that. God, I hope she never stumbles across this site and reads this....)
  26.  

    Considering how well-known we are, I think you’re safe.

    Plus, like I said, I have too much to do anyway atm.

    We should start a ‘the pitfalls and high points of cowriting’ thread to free up this one.

  27.  
    you're probably right. On both points.
  28.  

    Okay. Please add to it, otherwise it will languish.

    Back to backstories and swallowed-up stories.

  29.  

    Ok, on topic, because I didn’t want to make a new thread for backstories:

    How does one impart necessary backstory onto the reader? What methods (infodumpy prologue, dialogue, character’s thoughts, etc) do you like to use to convey information of that sort?

  30.  

    It can be tricky to do without seeming overly infodumpy. You can have your viewpoint character mentally review parts of it when said parts are relevant to whatever situation they are in(if they are the sort to do that). If they’re not familiar with it, they can ask questions about it to characters in the know, or said in the know characters can allude to the backstory through dialogue.

    One thing I tried to do was have my male lead make subtle references to people and places in his past without being overly explicit. The goal is to make the reader wonder what that’s all about until the blanks do get filled directly, so it feels like a relevant reward instead of just forcing needless information down the reader’s throat.

    So yeah, basically don’t be in a rush. If the character is written consistently from the get-go your reader won’t care if they don’t know all the background right away, so you can pace the rate at which you reveal it.

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      CommentAuthorAdamPottle
    • CommentTimeDec 7th 2009
     
    Do you know what's utterly cheesy but great? Inserting tourism pamphlets in lieu of directly describing a country. If these are factually... shaky or laughably out-of-date, so much the better. Perhaps an attached history supplement?
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    Ahaha, Adam, I don’t think that’ll work with my plot that I had in mind. Maybe for something with a parody/less serious nature.

    I think this is something that will really have to be taken care of in editing, because 75% of the way through NaNo, I had this idea, and so inserted it without any consideration for continuity or why it didn’t come up before and now everything’s all messed up. So yeah, editing will probably be necessary. Hopefully, I can insert the backstory a bit more subtly then. Hopefully.

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      CommentAuthorTakuGifian
    • CommentTimeDec 8th 2009
     

    I tend to waffle quite a bit (in pseudo character’s voice), so I slip details into the character’s thoughts. My characters tend to drift a bit like I do (well, my main character Taku mentally drifts, but there’s far less of that with Sieb, and the other characers are of course different again), so when I’m writing in Taku’s voice I slip details in as little tangential thoughts. “Taku sat down at the polished hardwood table, running a hand across the grain. He remembered having it custom-made in the city; it had cost a handsome chestnut colt.”

    Well, that’s actually a pretty terrible example, I haven’t got my writing boots on. But similar to that, but in the character’s voice, and far more naturally old-man-rambley.

    I also find it easier to introduce details that are new or foreign to the narrator. Like a man from a far-off land walking in. The narrator-character is going to notice the smell, the clothing, the skin colour, the shape of the face, stance, height and all of that, and take it in all at once to arrive at a value judgement.

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    I think it’d be funny to walk around with a writing pipe that spews bubbles. :D

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      CommentAuthorswenson
    • CommentTimeDec 15th 2009
     

    Heh, I call writing slippers! And a writing cloak, because I’m always cold when I’m writing.

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    We need a writing accessories thread.

    Bags writing earrings. Actually, a writing scarf would be easier.

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    I get writing sunglasses, since I actually did write the majority of my stuff whilst wearing them.

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    Lol.

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