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    • CommentAuthorUn-Dante'd
    • CommentTimeAug 14th 2009
     

    I think I covered it in the title.
    What a horrible attempt at a thesis… Let me redeem myself.
    ————————-
    Everybody has their own idea of what good-looking is. Some prefer lean bodies with darker tones, others lean towards the more solid and vibrant hues. Or a combination of them. Either or, it’s my opinion that when a book provides a description for it’s characters, the person is left with a permanent, set-in-Jell-o image (as it can change due to the events in the book). Take Jonathan Stroud’s The Bartimaeus Trilogy for example: Nathaniel is often described as foppish, lanky, and trying-too-hard-to-be-fashionable-look. When authors do that, it makes me wonder: does it take away from a reader’s involvement in the story?

    •  
      CommentAuthorswenson
    • CommentTimeAug 14th 2009
     

    Not describing a character’s appearance at all, though, leaves you with that sort of “floating head” feeling of fanfiction where you have to come up with everything on your own. I think a good writer would give description, but leave it vague enough that the reader has some direction to imagine the character, but is still free to view them however they like.

    •  
      CommentAuthorTakuGifian
    • CommentTimeAug 14th 2009
     

    I’d personally prefer a few vague details about hair colour and such, over a whole heap of description. There again, in y WIP I haven’t described any of my characters at all unless it’s in dialogue, (“oh you shaved your beard.”) or if someone very out of the ordinary comes along (like a northerner wearing northern-style clothes entering a south-eastern hotel, for example). Because all my descriptions are from the perspective of the POV character at the time, I tend to skip details that the character will know very well, and focus on those details that are different or have changed. Unless the character is dwelling on something or daydreaming about his lover’s hair and the way the sun reflects off it just so, although very few of my characters (thank goodness) are prone to that sort of contemplation.

    I much prefer to describe characters through their actions, and indeed the actions, voice and language-use of a character can help me form a particular image in my imagination of what they might look like. I don’t know if it’s the same image as someone else, but if someone acts and talks like a grizzled, battle-scarred ex-mercenary, I’m going to imagine a grizzled, battle-scarred ex-mercenary, with all the archetypical accoutrments; square jaw, broad shoulders, cleft chin, stubble, a scowl or a squint or both, lots of muscles and very little facial fat (possibly even sunken cheeks) etc. etc. etc.

    However, if the character isn’t described early on and then is described later, that will shatter my mental image, and thusly my suspension of disbelief. I learned that the hard way, a story I wrote for my fiction class had a female characrter, but the gender wasn’t explicitly stated anywhere until a few paragraphs in. And as I apparently have a rather masculine way with words, the class all had a mental image of a male, which was then shattered when I revealed that she was female.

    The lesson? Not only should boys never try to write from a girl’s perspective in first-person, but you should always include important details like gender and skin clour early.

  1.  

    Oh, I agree with gender and skin colour.

    I prefer writing with as little detail as to the character’s appearance, but I always get marked down for that. I prefer putting my own heads on people. Quite often, I just ignore the writer’s description of a character and make up my own. To me, Kitty from the Bartimaeus trilogy had curly hair (despite the fact that it’s explicitly stated that it’s straight).

    Not only should boys never try to write from a girl’s perspective in first-person,

    I think it’s the sort of thing that comes better with practice. Think of it like the internet. You always think everyone’s male no matter what their writing style. You think authors with initials are male. It may not have been your style at all, but people’s perceptions. Still, this does need to be accounted for when writing.

    •  
      CommentAuthorSpanman
    • CommentTimeAug 14th 2009 edited
     

    Eh, I generally show a character’s appearance through dialogue/actions, if I show it at all.

    •  
      CommentAuthorJabrosky
    • CommentTimeAug 14th 2009
     

    Of course, I then break that rule in my novel, by never actually mentoning the fact that all my main characters have dark skin. Why would I, I’m writing from the point of view of a character who has had and been surrounded by dark skin all his life, it’s not some unusual detail to be mulled over or even noticed. I rarely if ever think about the colour of my own skin, and even then it’s not in concrete colour terms that a reader would be able to pick up on and say “right! This character has this colour skin!”.

    That’s good reasoning, but how will you make sure people recognize that your characters are dark-skinned? What if some fan artist depicts them as light-skinned?

  2.  

    Well, I don’t think anyone ever says that ‘Mom has brown skin’ or something like that. They usually drop it in in some other context. For example, ‘Mom’s usually brown skin flushed, putting me in mind of a peach that had started to rot.”

    That’s a bad example, but you get what I mean.

    I usually drop in description like that.

    • CommentAuthorUn-Dante'd
    • CommentTimeAug 14th 2009
     

    I personally prefer something like “Built like a cougar, long and lean. Powerful.”

  3.  

    Have you ever found a picture that just is the character you’ve been writing about? It’s happened to me like once. This is one of the characters from the story I’m currently working on. (I know I’m an Amy Lee fangirl, but I saw this pic and went that’s her!)

    !http://blogs.westword.com/backbeat/amy%20lee%20(Small).jpg!

    (Why isn’t the pic posting properly? Usually it works…)

    • CommentAuthorUn-Dante'd
    • CommentTimeAug 14th 2009
     

    @SWQ
    Select “Textile”.
    And I’ve done that, but I’ve also tweaked them. I’ve been a fan of making my own characters in The Sims.

  4.  

    It’s the author’s character. He should describe the character in as much detail as he likes. Just like any scene, whether placed in a grand throne room or in the shoddy stable, or any situation where the character is doing something. You wouldn’t want an author to never explain how his character managed his magic, or leave it up to your imagination to figure out how that character got from point a to point b: “And then Doris managed to find her way over to this other place that wasn’t where she was before.”

    Details are in the author’s power and while there is possibly a case where a writer spends too much time obsessing over details, I would prefer to know that Doris took a hot air balloon to the kingdom of Gyrmesh, rather than be left to guess for myself. Same with a character’s features. An author might overdescribe like Meyer but there is a happy medium between her method and a “floating head” situation where the reader is left with no idea what is intended.

  5.  

    For some reason, it wouldn’t work with the other link. And yes, it’s super giant.

    • CommentAuthorUn-Dante'd
    • CommentTimeAug 15th 2009
     

    Amy Lee’s physical features would do well with a wise-woman or a rebellious princess.

  6.  

    Mom’s usually brown skin flushed, putting me in mind of a peach that had started to rot.

    because all parents are actually fruit. That one made me LOL

  7.  

    @ Steph: I said it was a bad example.

    @Un-Dante’d- the character in mind actually is a rebellious princess of sorts.

  8.  

    @ SWQ: Yeah I know. It was just funny, that’s all.

  9.  

    I’m not good at making things up. Or description. XD

    Don’t ask me why I like to write.

  10.  

    Way with words?

  11.  

    Perhaps. I just can’t think of things quickly. I need to ponder them and ponder them for long periods of time and after the glaciers melt maybe I’ll have something.

  12.  

    Pondering’s good.

    • CommentAuthorUn-Dante'd
    • CommentTimeAug 16th 2009
     

    Ever have a fantastic idea, and then you forget to write it down?

  13.  

    Ever have a fantastic idea, and then you forget to write it down?

    Yes. The other day, I had an intriguing idea, and I thought that even though there was a pen in my pocket and a notebook next to me, it would be better to imitate J. K. Rowling and allow the ideas to “thrive.”

    To end my rambling: they didn’t—they shriveled up and died.

  14.  

    Only every night as I fall to sleep. Of course, they are probably terrible ideas, because when I’m half asleep I’m not thinking straight anyway. But I do have the ideas, there’s no denying that. Sometimes I’ll remember one of those half-dreams days, or even weeks later, though. It’s a creepy, deja vu kinda feeling.

  15.  

    Only every night as I fall to sleep.

    Yeah, that’s my best time to think too.

  16.  
    Haha, I do the same thing.

    I'll tell myself 'I should write that in my idea-book....but it's all the way across the room....nah, I'll remember'
  17.  
    Lol, whenever I get an idea, I drop everything, run for the notebook, jot it down, and leave it to simmer in my mind. That way I get to let it 'thrive' but I also don't have the chance to forget it.
    • CommentAuthorUn-Dante'd
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2009
     

    Nice. I’ve had several great ideas for novels, among them a water-witcher/douser in Post-Apocalyptic Canada, a ghost, a man and his son who work for Your Own World Industries, a custom-planet contractor (Thank you, Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy).

  18.  
    Lol. I actually get that now.
  19.  

    Oh, I agree with gender and skin colour.

    I never quite know how to subtly describe skin color without saying, “He was black/white/purple with polka dots.” Or else sounding really stupid like, “His skin was darker than any I’d ever seen before,” and then comparing it to something of similar color.

    I like to know what the characters look like, so long as it’s consistent. Maximum Ride is a good example of not being consistent. Max’s hair is sometimes blonde and sometimes brown, and there is never a definitive description. I originally thought it was brown, but then adjusted to it being blonde, and then he said it was brown again. Ugh.

    •  
      CommentAuthorSMARTALIENQT
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2009 edited
     

    Think of it like the internet. You always think everyone’s male no matter what their writing style. You think authors with initials are male.

    Maybe it’s just me, but I always assume Internet authors are male (unless it’s fanfic. All fanficcers are female), but book authors are female. I always get… I don’t know, I get almost disappointed when I find out a man has written this book about a girl that I’m reading. It sort of shatters the illusion of “this will be written exactly as a girl is” and changes it into “this will be written as a man perceives a girl is.” I read one short book about a girl with a stutter. She had an incredible relationship with her dad, who took her birdwatching. She had a scary, domineering grandfather. Everyone at school thought she was stuck up because she didn’t speak much. It wasn’t the best of book specimens, but I remember being disappointed when I found out the author was a guy, and so I then noticed all the ways she didn’t act like a girl (at least to my fourth-grade mind).

    •  
      CommentAuthorKyllorac
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2009 edited
     

    I am a fan of the minimal character descriptions. General descriptions scattered throughout the story to give a basic idea of what the character looks like is fine, but anything more, and authors tend to get infodumpy with the describing. If I see a large chunk of text devoted to extolling the character’s physical appearance, I tend to get annoyed and just skip over it unless it’s part of the previously established writing style.

    To me, the most important aspect of the characters is not their appearance anyway; it’s their characters, their personalities. If they don’t have an enjoyable or compelling personality, there is no way that I will be willing to read about them, no matter how beautiful they supposedly are. Especially if they are supposedly leik OMIGAWD the most beautiful person in that story’s existence. Haven’t you noticed the sheer numbers of characters that are externally beautiful yet completely devoid of character? (coughBellacough)

  20.  

    (coughBellacough)

    But Bella has character… she’s you (or whoever is reading the book). Bella has infinite personalities. Maybe she has multiple personality disorder.

    But I agree that personality is MUCH more important than appearance.

  21.  

    So far I’ve tried to vary the level and type of description based on the sort of things the PoV character would be likely to notice. For example, my female lead would be more likely to notice unusual clothing, hair/eye color, that sort of thing, while characters introduced during male lead PoV portions are described more in terms of their physical builds, bearing, information that would matter if he suddenly has to kill them for some reason.

    Basically, it seems like you should describe as much about a person as you can without the description being intrusive.

  22.  

    For example, my female lead would be more likely to notice unusual clothing, hair/eye color, that sort of thing, while characters introduced during male lead PoV portions are described more in terms of their physical builds, bearing, information that would matter if he suddenly has to kill them for some reason.

    That’s an interesting method…

    For mine, the guy PoV kind of has a crush on the girl PoV, so he does focus a little more on her looks than she does on his, simply because he’d be more paying attention to it.

  23.  

    I almost always imagine characters to have brown or black hair, even when the book explicitly states that they have blonde or ginger hair. I still visualize Lyra as having brown hair, despite the fact that the book says that Lyra is blonde.

  24.  

    For mine, the guy PoV kind of has a crush on the girl PoV, so he does focus a little more on her looks than she does on his, simply because he’d be more paying attention to it.

    That makes sense. It’s the opposite to me, where the girl PoV is crushing on the guy PoV, which is pretty awkward for me to write, to tell you the truth.

  25.  

    I almost always imagine characters to have brown or black hair

    I tend to do this too, except with HP. I saw the first two movies first, so I saw the Weasley hair.

    But whenever a little girl/boy is supposed to be all sweet and angelic I see them with curly blond(e) hair.

    •  
      CommentAuthorPuppet
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2009
     

    I almost always imagine characters to have brown or black hair, even when the book explicitly states that they have blonde or ginger hair. I still visualize Lyra as having brown hair, despite the fact that the book says that Lyra is blonde.

    HDM right? I thought Pullman described her hair as honey colored…

  26.  

    No, dirty blonde, I think.

    @sansafro: I have a hard time describing beauty too. I’m afraid of going all ‘Edward-y’ if you get my drift.

  27.  

    I have a hard time describing beauty too. I’m afraid of going all ‘Edward-y’ if you get my drift.

    Well, it’s hard for me because it seems like there’s less in the way of “objective” attractive male traits, especially since my male is a pretty rugged guy, so I can’t just coast through the scenes where she starts being attracted on autopilot. Instead I have to think about it, which is a somewhat uncomfortable activity since I don’t find the male form very pleasing at all. Fortunately, she isn’t really cognizant of her feelings so far, so I don’t have to go into full-blown pining or something.

    I wouldn’t worry too much about getting carried away, as long as your character is getting carried away. Just have to balance characterization with readability, I suppose.

    •  
      CommentAuthorswenson
    • CommentTimeAug 18th 2009
     

    Unless you go to Bella-level carrying away. Then it doesn’t matter how carried away your character is, you need to tone it down a bit lot!

    •  
      CommentAuthorSMARTALIENQT
    • CommentTimeAug 18th 2009 edited
     

    There’s a fine line, I think, between Bella-level and satire-level. I think as long as you have foil character to point out how carried away your character is, it’s OK.

    For instance, here are two situations:

    Situation A:

    Lala: Oh, how I love Bonzo! He has eyes like crushed cinnamon, hair like a river of chocolate, and skin that emotes the slightest scent of honeysuckle! Ah, me! sigh

    Situation B:

    Lala: Oh, how I love Bonzo! He has eyes like crushed cinnamon!
    Lulu: Um, Lala-
    Lala: Hair like a river of chocolate!
    Lulu: You know, he isn’t that attractive. I mean, as guys go, he’s OK, but-
    Lala: Skin that emotes the slightest scent of honeysuckle!
    Lulu: Oh, please.
    Lala: Ah, me! sigh
    Lulu: facepalm

    See how our perception of Lala changes with the addition of Lulu? She’s saying the exact same thing, except we have a foil to show how carried away she is.

  28.  

    ^^This is true.

  29.  

    I wouldn’t really worried about approaching Bella’s level by accident, at least. That level of gushing seems like the sort of thing you have to do on purpose.

  30.  

    I would hope you have to do it on purpose.

    • CommentAuthorUn-Dante'd
    • CommentTimeAug 18th 2009
     

    Unless you’re obsessed with your own character.

  31.  

    Unless you’re obsessed with your own character.

    This probably happened in Twilight.

    • CommentAuthorUn-Dante'd
    • CommentTimeAug 18th 2009
     

    I wouldn’t doubt it. People have linked the description of Bella to the appearance of SMeyer.

    •  
      CommentAuthorPuppet
    • CommentTimeAug 18th 2009
     

    By SlyShy
    on Mar 1, 03:23 PM

    It might look like this…

    From: http://8th-circuit.com/?q=node/350

  32.  

    Let’s see, brown hair, brown eyes, widow’s peak, pale skin, etc.

    ...Who are we describing again? Oh, Bella. Yeah. That description doesn’t work for Meyer. Completely different.

    Edit: Man, Puppet posted right before me. I’ll leave this up anyway.

    • CommentAuthorUn-Dante'd
    • CommentTimeAug 18th 2009
     

    Lol. Completely off topic: next time you’re with your significant other, bake a pumpkin pie.

  33.  

    Somehow, I imagined Bella with black hair, especially since she says that she doesn’t have the excuse of light hair to make up for her pale skin. I also imagined her as slightly, slightly chubby – as in, not anorexically skinny, a tiny amount of flub due to her lack of sports prowess… I’m reading into this too much, aren’t I?