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  1.  

    I don’t think of Holden as my personal hero- he’s got flaws and lots of them- it’s that I could understand and empathize with a lot of what he was feeling. It’s interesting how he’s kind of a love-him-or-despise-him kind of character.

    I haven’t read A Clockwork Orange (though this may be soon rectified), Animal Farm, Great Expectations, or Count of Monte Cristo.

    •  
      CommentAuthorBlueMask
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011
     

    I’m late- but GRRM is an amazing writer, and I absolutely love his books, it’s just that every single woman seems to have no rights. I know, it’s pseudo-medieval, but it’s still infuriating.
    SNQ- Great Expectations- that’s on my to read list as well. Also, I’ve only ever read the adapted version of Oliver Twist.

    • CommentAuthorMnemone
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011
     
    The first HUNGER GAMES book is the best -- the characters should not have returned to the arena in the 2nd book, though that's the part with the best writing. The first book stands by itself as a very exciting book. I could see the movie spawning a TV spinoff where it's all about the games of years gone by. That might be a bit ironic, since the idiocy and sadism of reality TV and how it is regarded by society is part of the inspiration for the books

    GREAT EXPECTATIONS has Mr Jaggers, and he's awesome. I'm not sure he redeems the rest of the book, particularly Pip, one of my least favourite protagonists in literature.

    Read A TALE OF TWO CITIES instead.
    •  
      CommentAuthorBeldam
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011
     

    I never cared for Dickinson myself. His prose is too heavy—though, I avoid books from that period in general.

    The Catcher in the Rye is one of my favorite books, simply because nothing happens at all and it still manages to be pretty interesting. Also, I cried at the end. I’m told that Pride and Prejudice is very good, and I have every intention of reading Emma one day, and other books from that woman who I presently can’t remember the name of…

    I asked my parents if either of them had ever read A Clockwork Orange, and both of them were like, you cannot read that book oh no no, and I was all, oh, okay.

  2.  
    bq. Jaime

    The that really, really likes his sister? And the one that was responsible for maiming Bran?

    If he's a sympathetic character then so are people like Joachim Peiper and Otto Skorzeny.
    •  
      CommentAuthorPuppet
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011
     

    I’m late- but GRRM is an amazing writer, and I absolutely love his books, it’s just that every single woman seems to have no rights. I know, it’s pseudo-medieval, but it’s still infuriating.

    It isn’t the exact same as “rights,” but Cersei, Catelyn and Dany certainly have power.

    If he’s a sympathetic character then so are people like Joachim Peiper and Otto Skorzeny.

    Have you read all the books? Jaime may not be a “good guy” (Whatever that means…), but he’s still a sympathetic character.

    •  
      CommentAuthorApep
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011 edited
     

    @ Clib: He gets better once he spends time with Brienne in Storm of Swords, really he does. That’s about the point where starts to realize, “Hey, my sister’s kind of a bitch. Maybe I shouldn’t be listening to her.”

    Not that I’ve totally forgiven him for the whole ‘pushing-Bran-out-a-window’ incident, but at least he’s moving in the right direction.

    Personally, I blame Cersei for about 90% of everything wrong in the series.

  3.  
    bq. Have you read all the books? Jaime may not be a “good guy” (Whatever that means…), but he’s still a sympathetic character.

    Yeah, actually, (up to ADWD) and I still hate his guts like just about every other character in ASOIAF, truth be told the only one I could ever get excited about and actually care for was Brienne.

    bq. Personally, I blame Cersei for about 90% of everything wrong in the series.

    The one thing that would make me follow the series again would her horrible and agonzing death.
    •  
      CommentAuthorApep
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011
     

    Yeah, actually, (up to ADWD) and I still hate his guts like just about every other character in ASOIAF, truth be told the only one I could ever get excited about and actually care for was Brienne.

    It is hard to like a lot of the characters, given half the stuff they do.

    The one thing that would make me follow the series again would her horrible and agonizing death.

    Given the way things have been going for her, that’s a distinct possibility. I can’t wait for her trial. It’ll be like Joffrey’s wedding all over again.

    •  
      CommentAuthorPuppet
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011
     

    Personally, I found Brienne pretty bland and boring. I just don’t find anything about her interesting, myself.

    •  
      CommentAuthorFalling
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011
     
    Yeah, I never found Bienne's story particularly compelling. As much as I was angry with GRRM for killing of Stark (in retrospect, his alignment really is Lawful Stupid and not as sympathetic as I made him out to be) but after the fact I appreciated what GRRM was doing. But after awhile I ran out of sympathetic characters to root for (except for Barristan and more because he's epic in a couple scenes and then off-screen for the rest.)

    I get what GRRM is doing with his characters, but I find it about as compelling as all the characters of Pirates 3. After so many rounds of people screwing each other over like the backstabbing bastards they are I just didn't have a reason to go on. Selfish people are pretty uninteresting imo. Their motivation is pretty easy to figure out: me first.
    •  
      CommentAuthorswenson
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011
     

    Reminds me of Wuthering Heights, another book in which nobody is particularly sympathetic. But Wuthering Heights only stretches on for one book, not several.

  4.  

    jaime is great

    he is badass and funny and has a more developed moral compass than most characters but the nature of the setting breaks his moral compass early

    his arc is all about reconstructing it

    •  
      CommentAuthorThea
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011
     

    Oh dear. I kinda completely hated A Game of Thrones. But I did read it, so that’s not for this thread.

    You know what I haven’t read? Miss Peregrine’s Home for Peculiar Children. Fine, I don’t know that everyone has read it, but most of my friends/reviewers I follow have, and I even manged to get an ebook from the library and still. Didn’t. Read. It.

    Oh and the link to the spork of the Hunger Games. (sorry I’m so late in this).

    •  
      CommentAuthorInkblot
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011
     

    discovered urban fantasy/steampunk

    Welcome to my favorite world, BlueMask! If you’re like me, you’ll never want to leave.

    •  
      CommentAuthorFalling
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011 edited
     
    Oh here's two 1812 and Lord of the Flies. Two books, I'd like to read, but haven't.

    I don't know if it's just a Canadian thing, but for awhile everyone was talking about Life of Pi. No idea what's about and don't really intend on reading it.

    Oh in regards to steam punk, what are some good books? I've only recently become aware of it and I like the concept, as aesthetically it looks pretty cool. However, I don't really know who the good authors are.
    •  
      CommentAuthorInkblot
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011
     

    That’s tough. I’m in more on the art/lifestyle/conceptual side of steampunk and not so much the lit side. I know there are a few good ones and a lot of random junk though.

  5.  

    steam punk

    Isn’t Perdido St. Station kind of steampunkish? Even if it isn’t, it’s a damn good book.

    •  
      CommentAuthorBlueMask
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2011
     

    I just got a collection of steampunk short stories. It’s kind of half the genre I want to write, so I figured I might actually want to read some, first.
    I just love the idea of a kind of surreal, AU world. Kind of historical fanfiction, but with amazing fashion. And well written.

  6.  

    Perdido St Station is amazing, yes. Warning for some graphic inky moth sex, though. Don’t read it on a train ;)

  7.  

    Don’t read it on a train ;)

    I did. Nothing really happened.

    •  
      CommentAuthorBlueMask
    • CommentTimeDec 6th 2011
     

    I’ve heard really good reviews about that.

  8.  

    It’s good but the end really depressed me. If you like steampunk and want something different, go for it.

    •  
      CommentAuthorBlueMask
    • CommentTimeDec 7th 2011
     

    I vill, then.

    •  
      CommentAuthorEbelean
    • CommentTimeDec 9th 2011
     

    I haven’t read the Lord of the Rings trilogy. I got partway through the first, but got bored by the wanderings.

    The Hobbit was good though.

    •  
      CommentAuthorFalling
    • CommentTimeDec 9th 2011 edited
     
    Yes. Yes you have. GET OUT!

    Only joking. I fanatically love Lord of the Rings and tend to use his ideas and stories for examples of good storytelling. However, I fully recognize that it's not for everyone. My dad always fell asleep trying to read them and never got past the Council of Elrond.
    • CommentAuthorDanielle
    • CommentTimeDec 9th 2011
     

    I love LOTR for the story and for the landmark piece of literature it is, but I agree that Tolkien could have used a good editor.

    •  
      CommentAuthorApep
    • CommentTimeDec 9th 2011
     

    I’ll tell you the same thing I tell my brother’s girlfriend – the first half of Fellowship is an endurance test. It’s long and boring and almost nothing of any substance happens (at least until they reach Bree). BUT if you can make it past that, it picks up pretty quickly.

  9.  

    I think Tolkien said that he really didn’t know what he was going to do with the story until he got to Bree. Not sure were I read that. But I think it fit into the story, since the hobbits didn’t really know what they were doing or how to do it either.

    •  
      CommentAuthorswenson
    • CommentTimeDec 10th 2011
     

    A good friend of mine is exactly the same as you, Ebelean—she tried reading them but couldn’t get past the Old Wood because, in her words, “They’re just walking through the woods! For pages and pages!”

    You really do have to power on through the first half of Fellowship to get to the awesome parts. Once you get to Bree, things start to get more interesting, but then it hits the Council of Elrond and gets slow again until they actually get on their way. Then it picks up again pretty permanently.

    Not to start a movie vs. books argument here, but honestly, cutting out most of the early stuff in Fellowship may have been one of the best things Peter Jackson did when adapting LotR. It works in the book (or at least I can look back after having read it several times and it doesn’t bug me), but it would’ve just been taking up time and space in the movie. So I forgive him for cutting Tom Bombadil/the Old Wood and severely shortening the parts when they traveled in the Shire (and cutting out Fatty Bolger).

    • CommentAuthorDanielle
    • CommentTimeDec 10th 2011
     

    Not to start a movie vs. books argument here, but honestly, cutting out most of the early stuff in Fellowship may have been one of the best things Peter Jackson did when adapting LotR. It works in the book (or at least I can look back after having read it several times and it doesn’t bug me), but it would’ve just been taking up time and space in the movie. So I forgive him for cutting Tom Bombadil/the Old Wood and severely shortening the parts when they traveled in the Shire (and cutting out Fatty Bolger).

    Agreed. While I love Tom Bombadil, he didn’t really add much to the overall plot of the trilogy, let alone Fellowship. When I saw that he wasn’t in the movie at all, I wasn’t disappointed. Not in the slightest. Keeping the focus on the main storyline—Frodo’s quest to destroy the Ring and restore order to Middle-Earth—was part of what made the movies as good as they were.

    Personally, I think the Old Wood/Tom Bombadil chapters are best read as stand-alone chapters. They’re excellent, but they’re better read as a self-contained short story than as part of the larger whole.

    •  
      CommentAuthorWulfRitter
    • CommentTimeDec 10th 2011
     

    While I love Tom Bombadil, he didn’t really add much to the overall plot of the trilogy, let alone Fellowship.

    Agreed. To be honest, I don’t think there would have been a way to portray him in the movie that wouldn’t have made people like my mom think that all of us fans are just experiencing some sort of collective bad trip.