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  1.  

    Okay, so I’m writing a thingo originally based on the Grimm fairytale The Goose Girl and in my effort to not redo Shannon Hale, it’s starting to deviate quite a bit from the original tale. In that Falada is probably going to be cut out, and the blood-stained handkerchief will be thrown away after the princess is overpowered by her maid (because it didn’t work). Also, the princess is probably going to end up with Conrad, and the maid and the prince will fall in love. (Don’t ask me how I’m going to make the happy ending yet. I’m still working on it.)

    So this is some specific and general advice requested here: would I be killed or brutalised for deviating the way I have, so far? And how far can you deviate from a fairytale before you can call it your own?

    • CommentAuthorSlyShy
    • CommentTimeJun 9th 2009 edited
     

    I don’t think you’d be killed or brutalized. As far as your second question…

    Immature poets imitate; great poets steal

    It applies to more than poets. “Steal” the story and make it your own.

    •  
      CommentAuthorAmelie
    • CommentTimeJun 9th 2009
     
    Interesting topic... I've read Shannon Hale's version of the Goose Girl, I thought it was really good, by the way. I think it's fine if your story really deviates from the original, but then I don't know if you could really call it a "retelling" per se; it would be more like an original story with the fairy tale as inspiration. Kind of like fairy-tale fan fiction? :P But the thing is, once you're majorly changing the plot and reworking the characters, it would seem kind of weird to use the same characters' names as in the original fairy tale... because like I said, it wouldn't be a real retelling anymore. If I were you, I'd let your story, the way you're telling it, lead the way, because it's fun and it can help make you a better writer when you're forced to solve problems like that (didn't you write an article about this? lol). But I would change the names of the characters and really make them your own. Then at the beginning of the story you could put "Inspired by the classic fairy tale The Goose Girl" or something. I hope that helped.
    • CommentAuthorSlyShy
    • CommentTimeJun 9th 2009
     

    Hm. After more research, it appears that T.S. Elliot quote is often mangled. The full quote is:

    “One of the surest tests [of the superiority or inferiority of a poet] is the way in which a poet borrows. Immature poets imitate; mature poets steal; bad poets deface what they take, and good poets make it into something better, or at least something different. The good poet welds his theft into a whole of feeling which is unique, utterly different than that from which it is torn; the bad poet throws it into something which has no cohesion. A good poet will usually borrow from authors remote in time, or alien in language, or diverse in interest.”

  2.  

    Thankyou, Slushie. But ‘bad poets borrow, good poets steal’ OW2TE always sounds better.

    Thankyou, Amelie!

    But I would change the names of the characters and really make them your own.

    Conrad is the only named character in the original fairytale. All the others were made up by Shannon Hale. And no, it’s not really a retelling.

    EDIT: The other NAMES, I mean.

    •  
      CommentAuthorswenson
    • CommentTimeJun 9th 2009
     

    If you want a good example of a rewritten fairy tale, read Spindle’s End by Robin McKinley. The ending gets very, very weird and I still have no clue what happened, but it’s a great example of how you can take an original fairy tale and work from there. Technically it’s a retelling of the Sleeping Beauty and it has all the elements of the original (fairies at the christening of a baby princess, evil one wasn’t invited and curses the baby so she’ll die by pricking her finger on a spindle, one fairy is able to change the curse so the baby won’t die, the baby lives with fairies [although this might have been borrowed from the Disney version?], all the spindles in the kingdom are destroyed, baby grows up, baby STILL pricks finger on spindle, everyone in the castle falls asleep, thorns around the castle, etc. etc.), but it’s very different from the old story.

    • CommentAuthorSlyShy
    • CommentTimeJun 9th 2009
     

    Heh. I remember that. I read it for class.

    •  
      CommentAuthorRT3
    • CommentTimeJun 9th 2009 edited
     
    Oh I have just the thing for this. It's not particularly funny, but that's because I did it freshman year and it was supposed to be a fairly faithful transformation.

    *The Three Laser Pegasus Llamas Gruff*

    Once upon a time, there were three laser pegasus llamas, who were going past the mountains to the coastline to make themselves fat, and the name of all three was “Gruff.”

    But in the mountains lived a great cyclops, its one eye as great as the full moon, and his claws as terrible as the jagged mountain peaks.

    So it happened that the first pegasus llama Gruff that flew over the mountains was the smallest.

    Fwoop, fwoop, fwoop, went the wings of the pegasus llama.

    “Who’s that fwooping over my mountains?!?” roared the cyclops as he reared up his head into sight.

    “It is only I, the tiniest of the laser pegasus llamas Gruff, and I’m going to the coastline to make myself fat,” said the laser pegasus llama, with such a small voice.

    “Now I’m coming to fry you with my super laser eye and then eat you!” said the cyclops, and his eye began to glow terribly.

    “Oh no, pray don’t eat me! I’m little that I am,” said the laser pegasus llama. “Wait ‘til the Second Laser Pegasus Llama Gruff comes. He’s much bigger than I.”

    “Well then, be off with you,” said the cyclops, and the littlest laser pegasus llama flew off.

    A little while after came the second Pegasus Llama Gruff to fly over the mountains.

    Fwoop, fwoop, fwoop, went the wings of the pegasus llama.

    "Who's that fwooping over my mountains?!?" roared the cyclops as he reared up his head into sight.

    "Oh, it's the second Laser Pegasus Llama Gruff, and I'm going out to the coastline to make myself fat," said the laser pegasus llama, who hadn't such a small voice.

    “Now I’m coming to fry you with my super laser eye and then eat you!” said the cyclops, and his eye began to glow terribly.

    "Oh, no! Don't take me. Wait a little till the giant Laser Pegasus Gruff comes. He's much bigger than I.”

    “Well then, be off with you,” said the cyclops, and the second laser pegasus llama flew off.

    But just then up came the giant Pegasus Llama Gruff.

    Fwoop, fwoop, fwoop, went the wings of the giant laser pegasus llama, for his wings were so great that they blew back the long grass on the mountains, and the clouds themselves made way for him.

    "Who's that fwooping over my mountains?!?" roared the cyclops as he reared up his head into sight.

    "It's I! The giant Laser Pegasus Llama Gruff!” said the laser pegasus llama, in a great and terrible voice of his own.

    "Now I’m coming to fry you with my super laser eye and then eat you!” said the cyclops, and his eye began to glow terribly.
    Well fight me then, cuz I’ve got lasers,

    Pads (not hooves) and I’ve got tasers!

    Fight me then, you great big dummy,

    I’ll shoot a laser at your tummy!

    That was what the giant laser pegasus llama said. And the two clashed, like the great Titans of old, with more lasers, smoke, and explosions than a Pink Floyd concert. The giant Laser Pegasus Llama Gruff was feeling comfortably numb, and as such attacked with great ferocity, flying all around the great cyclops. The cyclops was unphased, though, and made attacks of his own, slashing at the laser pegasus llama with his terrible claws and firing his giant super laser all ‘round. The cyclops would strike and the giant Laser Pegasus Llama Gruff made to retreat, and vece versa. Finally, the giant Laser Pegasus Llama Gruff pinned down the cyclops!

    The other two Laser Pegasus Llamas Gruff apparated out of nowhere. The tiniest one ripped off the mask off the cyclops.

    “It’s Old Man Warren, the Jamba Juice manager!” gasped the second Laser Pegasus Llama Gruff.

    “Why???” asked the tiniest one, a look of shock and horror on his face.

    “I was sick of the soy, and the oranges, and the boosts! I wanted the fatty foods from the coastline, and I wanted them all to myself! I would’ve gotten away with it too, if it weren’t for you meddling Laser Pegasus Llamas Gruff and your dumb dog,” snarled the old man. And so the Laser Pegasus Llamas Gruff zapped the old man with their lasers, transporting him to a desert island with no confectionaries at all.

    Then they went to the coastline. There the laser pegasus llamas got so fat they were scarcely able to fly home again. And if the fat hasn't fallen off them, why, they're still fat; and so,

    Snip, snap, pow,
    I’m ending your misery now.
  3.  
    OK... I liked Beauty by Robin McKinley better than Spindle's End. :)
    •  
      CommentAuthorswenson
    • CommentTimeJun 9th 2009
     

    I know I read it, but I can’t remember what it’s about… oh wait, yes I do. It’s the Beauty and the Beast one. I liked that one too, except the end felt rushed to me.

    •  
      CommentAuthorAmelie
    • CommentTimeJun 9th 2009
     
    Yeah, RVL, I didn't really like Spindle's End. But I haven't read Beauty.
  4.  
    *Fwoop fwoop*

    I am going to be asking people if they fwooped over my mountains for days, now.
  5.  
    Yum, Jamba Juice. I live within walking distance of one.
  6.  

    Anyway. Just to make it clear, I’m not worried about deviating. That’s fine with me. The main problem I now have with it is that I’m not sure if starting off like this is going to seem like I’m cheating. Or like fanfiction. You know, using a cookie-cutter starting point.

    I don’t want it to seem like that :(

  7.  

    There’s nothing wrong with that for the first draft. Just write it. Then revise it. The better ideas always come out during the process of revision.

    • CommentAuthorCodeWizard
    • CommentTimeJun 15th 2009
     

    Rule of thumb: The final draft looks nothing like the first draft.

  8.  

    Hm. I hope so. But the basic premise will stay the same, right?

    Oh… well… um. Maybe not. True. Very true.

    • CommentAuthorMorvius
    • CommentTimeJun 16th 2009
     
    I quite liked how Andrezj Sapkowski twisted fairy tales to suit the Witcher universe.
  9.  

    Did he write in English? The name makes me think ‘no’.

    Anyway, news on the ‘Goose Girl’ front. The original premise will change quite a bit. CB and DA were right. And the REALLY good news? I have 2 choruses already written!!! And the best bit is, it’s an alto part! I always wanted to write a good alto part, cause most of the heroines are sopranos, or at least mezzos, right?

    Oh. Looking back, I just wrote that I was working on a ‘thingo’. Let me rephrase. I am working on a musical.

    It’s so exciting!!!

    EDIT: Wow, that looks like I’m bragging. Whoops.

    • CommentAuthorMorvius
    • CommentTimeJun 17th 2009
     
    Well, the first book of The Witcher saga has been translated (Blood of Elves). The first of the two short story collections by Andrejz has been translated too (The Last Wish). Anyway this is an example:

    In the Last Wish (one of the two short story collections), this wizard talks about how the girls who were born at a certain time were supposedly cursed (Rather debatable). And several of these girls, some princesses, were imprisoned in stone tower. And for some reason, a weird rumour began circulating and foolish princes started rescuing these maidens.

    There was also one about love but I should not spoil too much.
  10.  

    Lol that sounds cool.

  11.  

    @ steph: you’re an alto? awesome. I’m a soprano, but probably a mezzo. i love harmonizing though, but sopranos are mainly melody. i like melody too, but harmony is fun.

  12.  

    Yah. I recently grew into a higher range that I can sometimes hit, though, (when my vocal cords are warm enough) so I’m like a cross between an artificial mezzo and a natural alto. I LOVE harmonising. Especially up high instead of down low. Like when I’m just singing along and stuff. It feels like I’ve just gotten the key to a whole new level that I shouldn’t really be on.

    Still can’t sing ‘Phantom of the Opera’... :(

  13.  

    Go altos! I’m an alto, but my voice teacher refuses to believe me… And yes, harmonizing is wickedly awesome. :D

  14.  

    It sounds SOOOOOOOOOO cool! Why does your voice teacher refuse to believe you?

    (Mine doesn’t realise I can go lower the A below middle C), since he won’t try me on anything lower. And I don’t really have the courage to disillusion him…)

  15.  

    She’s under the impression that everyone she teaches is a soprano. rolls eyes I can go down to the E flat below middle C, but I’ve never actually been able to sing a song that low, as my voice teacher wants me to ‘expand my range.’ Yeah, well what about DOWN LOW?!?!?

  16.  

    Lol. You’re beating me by a semitone :(

    And down low is downright handy! (should we move this to a different thread, do you think?)

  17.  

    Perhaps… Here, I’ll create one.

  18.  

    Awesomeness.